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[Char]

Being on the autistic spectrum my eyes bounce around a lot~ movement, light, colour etc. My peripheral nervous system is highly sensitive~ not much I can do as it is an automatic nervous system response.

Now, I don't want to be leading a guy on, or playing games in any form, so guys, would you think a woman was interested if she glanced at you a couple of times but the rest of the time ignored you? Would you give her the benefit of the doubt or jump straight to a negative interpretation?

And if you were to date such a woman would you be comfortable knowing that she is not checking out the guys and gals, just as she is not checking out the sparrow hopping by, the caterpillar cocoon tucked under a swaying leaf, the great colours on a billboard, the unusual length of nails on someones hand, the curve of a passerby's elbow etc?

[Laura]

I have read this several times. I have given it alot of thought. I only ever dated one guy that thought I was checking out the competion because I was looking about.

We were in a new town having dinner and I was looking at peoples shoes and accessories to determine weather this would be a good target place for future heating and a/c sales. (My line of work) It is uncharictoristic of me to be that way but we had just had a meeting that afternoon about increasing sales and finding new prospects. I didn't turn work off.

He thought I was checking guys out. We no longer date but are friends. When we talk about it now we laugh a bit about it. He was insecure about dating me and dating period. The fact that I agreed to go out with him wasn't enough to convince him that I really wanted to spend time with him. The flip side is, I didn't shut work off and gave him reason to wonder.

I have learned and now don't do that anymore, (at least on a date). You can't help it. I would say it would be best to get that out in the open upfront on a date. This will eliminate any possibility of misunderstanding later.

Glancing at someone several times isn't a crime. If you do it somewhere and you think they are uncomfortable or misreading you. Approach them and tell them their shirt keeps drawing your attention, or you admire their choice in ties. Make mention that you will have to get your boyfriend one if your not interested in him. That pretty much clears it up.

[Char]

thx Laura~ yes, I do disclose when I think the time is appropriate. Sometimes that is within 30 mins of the first date, sometimes not till the second one.

Unfortunately~ I find that some people just don't care what the reason is~ they have already decided that I am playing mind games or that I am a person who just "wants everything and everybody" (as in materialistic and attention seeking).

I realise that it is their issue to own; I guess I'm wondering how different men here would react~ communication methods that I could use....?

~ sometimes I feel that I need to be wearing a badge~ like having to wear a gold star (if that is not an offensive metaphor for those of Jewish heritage). but I am not going to make it the first thing I talk about myself, I am more than my physiology~

[Laura]

How frustrating it must be for you.

It is ashame that a guy wont tackle this one. I would like to hear what they think as well. We seem to be on the same page pretty often. I would suppose you have already examined the idea of those that go there so quickly are very insecure.

I'd really like to see some guys answer this one as well.

[Char]

yeah~ come on guys!!!

Laura~ I know that my idiosyncrasies can draw unwanted attention to myself~ and if I ignore/am not aware that men are paying attention to me because they think I am paying attention to them~ I am labeled arrogant. And if I do notice and say something~ some continue to say arrogant.

At the end of the day~ I think some just look for any reason to undermine your confidence (female and male)

[Steve]

One of best relationships was meeting this girl at a party. I had never met her before, but I noticed her looking over, I knew it was not just a glance. Also I felt there was a chemistry between us, we ended up kissing before we had spoke to each other. Afterwards she explained she felt the same thing and that are body language spoke volumes.

I think it depends on the individual identifying what the signals are. Today it is getting harder to see the signals because they are becoming more subtle or misread. Some people don't respond because what someone has used as a signal before does not mean everyone else will see it and then it becomes misread for rejection when its just a simple case of not knowing.

There is a difference between a glance and a look.If a guy comes over and you don't mean it, maybe you are holding your stare too long.

[Char]

Steve~ I have only to glance at a person sometimes. Besides, when I am glancing it tends to be because I have seen movement (I have an extremely sensitive peripheral vision) or something about them has caught my attention and set off a spectrum of associations~ it is a glance, not a stare.

So many people, female and male, end up receiving several glances from me because they are moving and its' caught my attention or associations are triggered by how they move/what they are wearing etc.

My glance though can be "intense", because when I look at a person a series of associations are going off, I see in video which is probably why. It is also why the glance is a glance, I have to look to the side to see the video.

Basically, I am constantly training myself not to "notice" people, and to make brief eye contact so that I don't come across as "seeing into their soul". I would prefer though that the guys didn't feel that I was toying with them, though as my counselor has said, it is not my responsibility what others choose to think about me.

In reality though, the grapevine, "boy's club/big brother" and just general pettiness of some people can result in my being ostracized, branded, and retaliated against. These four concepts took me years of reflection and research to become aware of. And because people don't make direct statements most of the time, I am not aware that a guy thinks that I like him or that he is being toyed with until a series of insinuations in conversations from others builds up to a level for me to recognise that people are actually talking about me when referring to other people.

So guys, what is a clear physical signal from a woman that she is not interested? I tried ignoring, moving so that my back was to a person, walking away, raising my eyebrows inquisitively, sticking a finger up my nose...

And I tell people now that I am autistic...options is what I am looking for folks...

[Steve]

In reality though, the grapevine, "boy's club/big brother" and just general pettiness of some people can result in my being ostracized, branded, and retaliated against. These four concepts took me years of reflection and research to become aware of. And because people don't make direct statements most of the time, I am not aware that a guy thinks that I like him or that he is being toyed with until a series of insinuations in conversations from others builds up to a level for me to recognise that people are actually talking about me when referring to other people.

I will have to agree with you with this because I have had similar experiences. It would be great if people could be make direct statements. I think people get a kick out of talking about people behind there backs in front of them, makes them feel powerful where in fact its pathetic.

I think we live in a society which is afraid to express our feelings verbally, if you can't say how you feel then there cannot be anything there.

So guys, what is a clear physical signal from a woman that she is not interested? I tried ignoring, moving so that my back was to a person, walking away, raising my eyebrows inquisitively, sticking a finger up my nose...

And I tell people now that I am autistic...options is what I am looking for folks..

If the above are not working you must have stalkers. Some people will not understand unless you do make a direct statement and sometimes that's the best thing for them.

[Char]

thx for the validation Steve~ yes, I have taken to documenting behaviours and looking for cues from others as to when a behaviour is unacceptable (I may be a latent sociopath because there are so many social nuances that I have to teach myself)

The other week I discovered that lifting a bottle of milk (whilst reading a book) had three guys put their head down and move on. Something about milk=child or wanting mum??? I don't know, I feel like I live in a world of borgs and I have to be at least pseudo-borg to navigate without being seen as a threat and them wanting to assimilate me.

I find a lot of communication with non-autistics' to be overly structured, deindividuated, systematic, negatively orientated and locked into a game of "top dog", I am from a paper-rock-scissors persuasion~ can't be just one winning all the time or there is no game, and each piece is a complement for another. I do not see how the former is functional~ it creates ill health, sadness and fear to take risks.

This week I will experiment with different face pulling activities (yesterday I saw that talking while gently turning my head side to side sent the message "No") and my key push words will be "How's your girlfriend?"
"How many kids do you have?" "There you go then" and "Alrighty, back to it then". Discovered last week that such activities are referred to as "management"~ now to practice without abusing the power of the meanings some have loaded words with.

[Steve]

I find a lot of communication with non-autistics' to be overly structured, deindividuated, systematic, negatively orientated and locked into a game of "top dog", I am from a paper-rock-scissors persuasion~ can't be just one winning all the time or there is no game, and each piece is a complement for another. I do not see how the former is functional~ it creates ill health, sadness and fear to take risks.

'A game of top dog' is more like an exposure to how pathetic they are. I have been completely alienated before by these idiots in the work place. Where I have come in and the atmosphere has changed and I might as well have been invisible, it was demoralising.
Until one lunch time when another colleague was away from the rest said don't get down about it because they are jealous about who you are, they want to be like you but they cannot, that's why they have been bitching behind your back. So now I smile when things like this happen because being my self really gets to these idiots. They feed on by seeing you get down, if you keep smiling they cannot cope and start doing stupid things, exposing themselves of who they really are.